 | ||||
| ||||
Gaits of Gold Gaited Horse Community Messageboard > Tack Discussion > Imus Comfort Gait Bit™ Discussions > RMH with bit issues- back to ICB |
| | ||||
| ||||
Gaits of Gold Gaited Horse Community Messageboard > Tack Discussion > Imus Comfort Gait Bit™ Discussions > RMH with bit issues- back to ICB |
| Moderated by: Brenda Im | Page: 1 2   |
|
|||||||||||||
| RMH with bit issues- back to ICB | Rate Topic |
| Author | Post |
|---|
| Posted: Sun Feb 24th, 2008 08:33 pm |
|
1st Post |
|
Mountainhorse G.O.G Community Member 
|
I must have the fussiest horse in the world. He has an issue with all his tack, and thank heavens I got the Imus saddle, because he loves it and I do too. Even when he spooks or jumps I stay in that saddle!tu1 I feel so safe in that saddle, and even with my bad RA, kneee surgeries, hip replacements, I can be totally comfortable in a long ride. Okay, I'll stop raving now.;) I am still dealing with bit issues.  I had him in the ICB for a few weeks, but he was fussy so I put him back into a full cheek snaffle. He is rideable though resistant to the bit. We do lots and lots of flexing and groundwork etc, etc, he just hates bits. Today I tried an all chain curb bit (without the leather ends) and set it tighter.I clipped on the reins UNDER the curb chain, and dh said that was wrong, so I clipped the reins over it. When I tested him on the ground, I saw that pulling the reins like this didn't make him have any contact with the curb chain. I got on anyhow, and this is the first time my horse bucked like crazy. Thankfully, I remembered the one rein stop! I worked him on the ground a lot, had my husband stand next to the horse's head, got on again, another bucking session. Dh noticed that when I turned him ,the long part of the snaffle twisted into his mouth. So I got off, untacked saddle and all, checked everything and then set the clip to the reins underneath the snaffle (so between the bit and curb chain), and after lots of flexing he was a-okay again. NOW, I really want him to wear the ICB after this whole fiasco. I used to use it on him with the snaffle, until he got resistant to it. Basically he has issues with bits. How about if I try him in the ICB with the shank ? Should I use the curb chain ? He's never been in a shank. Yes, his teeth have been done recently, the vet checked him out, he flexes GREAT on the ground and under saddle. If I ride with contact, it was to be with very light contact, or of course loose reins which he loves. I just want this issue to resolve itself the way the whole saddle issues got resolved with Brenda's saddle. What would you recommend ? Thanks so much for any advice. This board is the greatest, and my horse and I have come so far in two years ! I even got him to gait the other day.tu1 Anne-Marie Last edited on Sun Feb 24th, 2008 08:35 pm by Mountainhorse |
||||||||||||||
| |||||||||||||||
| Posted: Sun Feb 24th, 2008 11:48 pm |
|
2nd Post |
|
whattarack Pasture Boss 
|
____________________ Being Offended is Optional. |
|||||||||||||
| ||||||||||||||
| Posted: Mon Feb 25th, 2008 12:00 am |
|
3rd Post |
|
Brenda Im Pasture Boss 
|
Perfect, whattaNOTbutta. . . However, I feel I should point out the obvious - your horse may be simply spoiled, and that's how it sounds to me. A horse that works fine out of a good piece of tack, but then 'develops' resistance. . .may have found a way to get around your cues. Hang in there. Expect the tack, once it is correctly positioned, to work - and THEN expect (demand) that your horse respond accordingly. Just a thought. PB 
____________________ Always forgive your enemies. It's good for you - and really messes with their heads! |
||||||||||||||
| |||||||||||||||
| Posted: Mon Feb 25th, 2008 01:04 am |
|
4th Post |
|
Mountainhorse G.O.G Community Member
|
Whatta- very interesting info on curb chains. Wow, I learned a lot. Thanks. I think it sounds too harsh to me, so I will make it looser or do away with it. Brenda- I spent the rest of the afternoon reading all of your articles. Geez, I learned so much more. I think it should be mandatory reading for every gaited horse buyer. Thanks for your input. Yes, he IS very spoiled , bratty and smart, he gets into mischief all day long. I can flex him without a halter or anything, by standing next to him he flexes automatically. It sounds like from what you say that I've been outsmarted by him.b1 Thank you.
|
|||||||||||||
| ||||||||||||||
| Posted: Mon Feb 25th, 2008 11:58 am |
|
5th Post |
|
JoyRider G.O.G Community Member 
|
I am confused (again, sorry doesn't take much). But did Mountain Horse put a curb chain on a snaffle bit? Last edited on Mon Feb 25th, 2008 11:59 am by JoyRider ____________________ Revelation 19:11 |
||||||||||||||
| |||||||||||||||
| Posted: Mon Feb 25th, 2008 01:34 pm |
|
6th Post |
|
Mountainhorse G.O.G Community Member
|
Yes, that's the tack he had at the trainers and they always used the curb chains. I am confused, too.  Plus, after Brenda's post I got to thinking that my horse is terrible to turn to the left, and as it happens my left side has the hip replacement and a very weak arm; maybe this is related? Last edited on Mon Feb 25th, 2008 01:37 pm by Mountainhorse |
|||||||||||||
| ||||||||||||||
| Posted: Mon Feb 25th, 2008 06:04 pm |
|
7th Post |
|
TN Trailrider G.O.G Community Member 
|
A curb chain should not be used with a snaffle bit ... the true snaffle with the rings and jointed mouth piece. When you pull back on the reins it can a nutcracker effect on the tongue and with severe hands, can actually cut the tongue.
____________________ Lynne |
||||||||||||||
| |||||||||||||||
| Posted: Mon Feb 25th, 2008 08:35 pm |
|
8th Post |
|
Brenda Im Pasture Boss
|
A 'true snaffle' is any bit that works directly of the reins/rider's hands - regardless of the mouthpiece. A curb bit is any bit that works off indirect pressure - again, regardless of the mouthpiece. It's true that a snaffle bit does not require a curb chain, and using one with a broken mouth snaffle (not a good choice, IMO) does exert a nutcracker effect. This is even more true with a broken mouthpiece on a curb - such as a Tom Thumb bit. The TT exerts terrific pressure and pain unless the horse anticipates the rider's intent and responds instantly. . .not exactly soft, willing cooperation! PB
____________________ Always forgive your enemies. It's good for you - and really messes with their heads! |
|||||||||||||
| ||||||||||||||
| Posted: Tue Feb 26th, 2008 12:37 am |
|
9th Post |
|
Mountainhorse G.O.G Community Member
|
Thanks. I feel horrible now. s2 No wonder he hates his bits. But in my defense, the farm he was at, all the horses had to have a cavesson (sp?) and a curb chain, even with the snaffle. (and they were tight, mine was always loose). I only kept him set-up the way they trained him and how they sent him home. Yikes!!! Maybe that's why he is so resistant to the bit. The first trainer that started him used a tom thumb with a finely twisted wire bit. I threw that away a long time ago. Please, one last question. With the ICB, should I use the snaffle or the longer shank part ? no curb chain ? because the pic does show where to put the curb chain. What would be the kindest/gentlest set up? dumb-founded Anne-Marie
|
||||||||||||||
| |||||||||||||||
| Posted: Tue Feb 26th, 2008 01:50 am |
|
10th Post |
|
whattarack Pasture Boss
|
Here's my thoughts about the ICB in the curb position: I see a couple posts lately about being kinder to the horse in the snaffle. My horse (accustomed to a curb bit) won't ride in the snaffle without me yanking the crap out of her head. She came to me in a curb but not a good curb as I have learned. My guess is she probably never rode in a snaffle bit (seems some of the gaited don't get that part of training) But anyway . . . She easily transitioned to the progressive requests of of ICB in the curb position and properly adjusted curb chain. Also, I am direct reining (with the curb. Yep.) I am sure I could get her to work in the snaffle but at this point (she's 10 now I think) why? I'm a little indifferent to that with her. Should I not flex in the ICB in the curb position? My horse thinks she can.  Oh, back to my thoughts about the curb:  The ICB is progressive by design. (Brenda, correct me if I am wrong). The signals the horse receives as the reins are: When you take on the reins, the horse receives request at the poll which is a request to lower the head With a little more take on the reins, the horse receives request at the chin via curb chain which is a request to tuck the chin And then, a little more take on the reins the horse is in ready to respond the your requests: such as turn The 3 progressive steps are: Lower, tuck, and take When the horse is transitioned properly to (leverage) the curb position, the response will be easy, gentle and quite humane. Tip: If direct reining with the ICB, be SURE to give slack on one rein as you take on the other when requesting a turn. tu1 Sorry so much babble - 
____________________ Being Offended is Optional. |
|||||||||||||
| ||||||||||||||
| Posted: Tue Feb 26th, 2008 02:45 am |
|
11th Post |
|
peach G.O.G Community Member 
|
Don't aplogize. I have learned so much from your 'Babble". Babble on lady.!-|-
____________________ Go be a blessing to someone today... |
||||||||||||||
| |||||||||||||||
| Posted: Tue Feb 26th, 2008 02:48 am |
|
12th Post |
|
Mountainhorse G.O.G Community Member
|
whattarack wrote: The ICB is progressive by design. (Brenda, correct me if I am wrong). The signals the horse receives as the reins are: Whatta- Great information. I really get it.tu1tu1 Thanks for explaining that so well, especially since I seem to have gotten so much bad info from my horse's actual trainers.s2 You are very patient!l1 Now, how do I know he is transitioned properly and ready for the curb position, and did you mean YES he can be flexed laterally with it ? We do lots of flexing on the trail, too, especially now that we are done with all the round pen and arena work - on the trail he just wants to go, go, go, so we stop to do some flexing. the light is dawning- Anne-Marie
|
|||||||||||||
| ||||||||||||||
| Posted: Tue Feb 26th, 2008 03:18 am |
|
13th Post |
|
whattarack Pasture Boss
|
You know your horse best so do be sensitive to his sensitivities. You don't want to put a new set up (changing from snaffle to curb) in his mouth and simply ride without testing your communication skills and looking for any adjustments that might be necessary to achieve them. It is a harmony with the horse that you are looking for. It comes from light and patient actions on your part as well as being sensitive to his reactions. You can start with a loose rein and just let your horse walk. If he speeds up just use a gentle check and then release. Use a long low leading rein for circles and serpentines as he gets used to the bit. Remember to give slack to the off rein. Example: when turning or leading to the left, give slack in the right rein so you are not confusing him. Gentle practice and patience should transition him just fine. ;) Should I not flex in the ICB in the curb position? My horse thinks she can.This is also a question for me. Taylor doesn't seem to mind but I'd guess it's not good to do flexing exercise in a curb - I dunno. t2 Last edited on Tue Feb 26th, 2008 11:27 am by whattarack ____________________ Being Offended is Optional. |
||||||||||||||
| |||||||||||||||
| Posted: Tue Feb 26th, 2008 03:25 am |
|
14th Post |
|
whattarack Pasture Boss
|
Is your horse rushing? Here is Brenda's article about that. http://www.gaitsofgold.net/content/view/38/35/
____________________ Being Offended is Optional. |
|||||||||||||
| ||||||||||||||
| Posted: Tue Feb 26th, 2008 01:42 pm |
|
15th Post |
|
Brenda Im Pasture Boss
|
Whatta gave you wonderful advice and information here - I wouldn't change or qualify a thing. Thanks, Sharon. As for flexing in the curb - it is entirely possible with the ICB because of the pinchless, independent action from side to side. Just use a direct rein with low hands, and as Whatta pointed out, be sure to give slack on the outside rein as you take on the inside rein. Otherwise you're basically pulling on both sides, creating confusion. I highly recommend you get a copy of the 3-DVD set, Gaits from God. It covers every question you might think to ask, and then some. There's an extensive section on bits and bitting that I've had wonderful feedback from. Best yet, right now it's on sale, so you can save 30 bucks! (Till the end of this week.) You sound like a gal who is going to ask the right questions, listen to her horse, and become an excellent horseman. What fun! PB
____________________ Always forgive your enemies. It's good for you - and really messes with their heads! |
||||||||||||||
| |||||||||||||||
| Posted: Tue Feb 26th, 2008 02:36 pm |
|
16th Post |
|
ladybug G.O.G Community Member 
|
Mountianhorse, Im so proud of you, Look how far you have come since your first posting on the board about your horse, and now your even trail riding. You go girl!! Dont you love all the helpful info on here, it has help me thru so much as well. Hey, I new we had a connection some how, and now its clear, I also had a total hip replacement as well, but mine is on the right side, and I totally believe it affects the way Thunder moves, as I tend to not sit deep in the saddle on that side. Im real protective of that hip. Anyway, so glad your getting all the help and good info on the board. I have the DVD as well and it was even more wonderful as you can actually see everything that your learning about. Keep up the good work with you sweet boy.
____________________ A WOMANS PLACE IS ON A HORSE !! |
|||||||||||||
| ||||||||||||||
| Posted: Tue Mar 4th, 2008 01:56 pm |
|
17th Post |
|
Mountainhorse G.O.G Community Member
|
Whatta- Thanks for the link on rushing. I love reading those articles over and over again, every time I get some new out of them. Gosh, so much stuff to work on.t2 Brenda- Yes, I totally need this DVD series. I'm going to order it. Can't wait to get some visual info. Even my husband can use it for his SSH/TW.tu1 Ladybug- Yep, we do have a lot in common!!tu1 You are right, I totally love the nice people here, every one is so kind and generous with their advice. I learn so much here, even just reading old posts.
|
||||||||||||||
| |||||||||||||||
| Posted: Tue Mar 4th, 2008 02:22 pm |
|
18th Post |
|
Mountainhorse G.O.G Community Member
|
Well, on Sunday we did our first major trail-ride, which, due to getting lost on the trails4, lasted 3 and 1/2 hours, and I feel the pain, ugh.;) We went with friends, who supposedly knew the trail, and my first observation is that the number of spooks get multiplied by the number of horses on the trail. Whiskey (people thought Medicine was too weird a name), my RMH, is virtually unflappable and fearless, but the other horses did spook often so of course it was Monkey see, Monkey do.  I HOPE spooking is not a learned behavior. Lesson learned is that I need to keep him up front in trail rides because I want him to stay confident.We got one major spook when the dh's horse got spooked by two ducks flying up next to him, and Whiskey jumped about 10 feet sideways, circled and bucked, and I lost my seat, but holy cow!!! I stayed in the saddle.tu1tu1 There is definitely something about this Iums saddle that keeps you IN it. BUT, I tacked him up with just the snaffle, no curb chain, and I had no control and he got to wanting to buck. I put the curb chain on loose, even though y'all said NO curb Chain with snaffle, this got me some control but he is just awful to turn, very resistant to the bit and he just about rips my arms out. We did loads of flexing before and on the trail, but he has a mind of his own and is almost impossible for me to turn. He has a mind of his own. This week I'll start him with the Imus Comfort bit, shank with curb chain and hope this will give me more control. I'm also at a loss with this new issue of wanting to buck when I get on....I have to get on with dh holding him, he has to lead me around while W's holds his head up really high, then I have to walk him really slow, fight with him over the bit, then flex and flex and flex and then he is okay but reistant as can be. (pathetic whining coming up, please skip) On a side note, not to be too complaining, but I have two daughters adopted from Russia three years ago, and the little one, 9, has so many behavioral and emotional issues, every day is a struggle. Her sister, 15, is only slightly better behaved and has totally different issues. Plus I have so many health problems, and Whiskey is supposed to be my escape, and naturally he has so many issues himself. (I'm donewhining). Thanks......Anne-Marie
|
|||||||||||||
| ||||||||||||||
| Posted: Tue Mar 4th, 2008 03:09 pm |
|
19th Post |
|
ladybug G.O.G Community Member
|
Dear friend,1l I feel you pain, have been thier and sometimes still doing it. Im a full time Mother, also take care of family members with problems as well, and My horse has to be the one thing in my life that is not stresfull for me. Trust me the first year Thunder and I were together thier were times when I thought, this is not going to work. He has a mind of his own as well, and definatly would always test me. It takes time to figure out what he responds to best to get him to do what I ask. Thier are 50 ways to correct one problem but the hard part is finding out which one will your horse respond to that is best for you and him. Once you find it, then all is well again. And you can use it for future problems when they come up. Now, on the other hand from all that you are saying he does with you trying to ride and put the bit on and him having his head up high and even bucking, that definatly sounds like he has had some pain and may still be having a pain issue some place to be bucking while you ride. I know you have checked every thing, but it just seems like something must be really hurting for him to act out like that. Dont give up, maybe even take a day or two and just give your self a breck from it to clear you mind and emotions, as they will pick up on any emotional energy that you put out as well. I think he is really trying to tell you something, and I have faith that in time you will figure it out. Big huggs coming to you!!w2
____________________ A WOMANS PLACE IS ON A HORSE !! |
||||||||||||||
| |||||||||||||||
| Posted: Tue Mar 4th, 2008 03:19 pm |
|
20th Post |
|
GypsySusan G.O.G Community Member 
|
Dear Anne-Marie: Whine all you want. If it helps keep you sane during an "insane" period of your life, we are here to listen, encourage, and strengthen. I have also been in your shoes but with only one daughter. I can't imagine making it through with 2. If you truly need an escape, PM me and I'll listen and help with anything I can. Hang tight; it's for the good of your girls and yourself. I'll be praying, With Our Lord's Love, Susan
____________________ Susan http://www.gypsytrotters.com Phil 4:11-13, 19 Missouri Fox Trotters: To Ride One... Is to Own One. |
|||||||||||||
| ||||||||||||||
| Current time is 10:37 pm | Page: 1 2 |
| Gaits of Gold Gaited Horse Community Messageboard > Tack Discussion > Imus Comfort Gait Bit™ Discussions > RMH with bit issues- back to ICB | Top |
