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Gaits of Gold Gaited Horse Community Messageboard > Gaited Horse Training Discussions > Gaited Horse Training > Is tack always the answer? |
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Gaits of Gold Gaited Horse Community Messageboard > Gaited Horse Training Discussions > Gaited Horse Training > Is tack always the answer? |
| Moderated by: Brenda Im |
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| Is tack always the answer? | Rate Topic |
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| Posted: Mon Oct 2nd, 2006 09:30 pm |
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1st Post |
walkerlover66
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This has been a WONDERFUL site for support for myself since I joined up over a year ago. Over the time (especially as of late) I have been a little disheartened by the Imus team responses to some posts and I feel I need to say something In respect to the board, members and what Brenda has to offer to 'some' people, I was at a gaited clinic this weekend. There were 12 horses. All with different saddles and tack. There was one Imus saddle and 3 horses with the ICB. The clinician started with basic horsemanship and explained how being soft in the hands can improve a horse instantly. By the afternoon, there was a difference already. He went on to each horse individually, assessed their gait and adjusted with VERY light weights on either the front or back. This helped a horse as well. I believe most riders felt a difference in their horse immediately. Honestly, the horse that had the worst gaited performance was the one under the Imus saddle. This same horse had the MOST improvement over the course of the two days. Many people sat inthe IMUS saddle and found it comfortable, including the stirrups. The clinician suggest that the saddle be put back on the horse just a bit. The rider said the saddle was made to sit right where it is, and if he did, it would slide all over the place. I had a close look at the saddle and I don't get how the strap over the neck leaves room for proper movement. The horse was also stiff in the ICB bit. Almost afraid to make a move in the bit. The clinician suggested a plain snaffle for the next day. There was a difference. A combination of what the people learned in the hands and seat improved the gait. Not the tack. I noticed the horse that was changed to the snaffle was much more relaxed in her gait and had more of an overstride, improved head movement, but was a little harder to control. I suggested to the rider to put the imus bit back in to see the difference for the rest of the clinic. He did, and he felt more in control with the ICB, but, the gait tightened up again and she was definately more tense. The other two horses that had the ICB bit in were fantastic. My main point of this post is... There were 12 horses in the clinic and all horses improved immensely WITHOUT changing tack. It bothers me to see the Imus team to be so quick to respond with the "have you checked the saddle fit?"..."the bit is wrong"..."the pad is wrong". Certainly the Imus line works wonders for some horses and riders, but I truely believe that it is not the FIRST thing to look at. I realize this site is geared towards the Imus line, but I think more importantly it should be geared towards our beloved gaited breeds. If I get lynched for this, so be it. I really felt I needed to post this. Kathy
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| Posted: Mon Oct 2nd, 2006 10:29 pm |
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2nd Post |
tangoh
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I was one of the three that Walkerlover mentioned that was riding with the Imus bit. I love the bit. Thanks Kathy for saying my horse was fantastic. And I will pass the same compliment back to you. For a young horse like Artey, and for someone that hasn't been in the saddle too long...the two of you are doing awesome! It was a pleasure to meet you in person and ride with you in the clinic and I just can't say enough how pleased I was with the results and with the approach and technique of the trainer. In a word....awesome. I hope I'm allowed to talk about another trainer here.... Let's face it folks, there's a lot of great trainers out there, and Brenda and her team of GOG trainers are definitely among them. BUT; I'm also one of the 12 that wasn't in a 4 beat. I ride in a **** and if I get deleted for mentioning that, then so be it. I've been in it for 6 years and I honestly feel my saddle fits my horse well, he is comfortable, loose and gaits well, has never complained when I mount, dismount, never flinches or turns and bites at the saddle and the sweat marks and the condition of his back, and his way of going, which is quite rounded since his head is never high, tells me I have the right saddle for my horse. However, the clinician noticed that my horse was under utilizing his hind end and was at times, doing a fox trot. With some softening techniques, and learning to motivate my horse to stay in gait, and move up into the bit, I saw a massive improvement by the end of Day 2. He was a head nodding, 4 beat run walking, motivated-to-move horse and was using the big motor in his BIG back end a lot more. He was staying in gait rather than breaking gait. I was the problem...not the tack. I was not giving him constant motivation. Along with some other very valuable exercises and tips from the trainer, I now have the tools to improve what I thought was an already great horse. All horses, in fact, showed major improvement at the end of Day 2. We were all in 'better frame', giving our horses clear signals, and communicating what we wanted much clearer, thanks 100% to the clinician. What I learned was that even though we are riding gaited horses and we wanted the clinic to be all about the 'gait', there are some basic things that have to happen before a horse can gait well. Proper communication, giving to the bit, softening, lateral flexion, impulsion from behind...the list goes on. These are all things that must happen with 'any' horse before 'any' horse will gait well, regardless if it's gaited, or non-gaited. Conformation also plays a role in whether a horse will gait, and what gait it will peform. The man in the 4 Beat is a close friend of mine. I too, like walkerlover, feel that he was far too forward, even in comparison to people I have seen on this site with their 4 Beat. The Imus bit was definitely too much for this horse. I had suggested he move it to the snaffle position, which he did for a while out of the arena, but the horse softened and responded, like walkerlover said, much better in the plain snaffle on Day 2. Maybe the colt starting bit would have been a better choice for her. For now, a plain snaffle is what works best. I'm sure the 4Beat is a good saddle, but like I'm sure Brenda would attest to, it's not for every horse, and not every horse will need a 4Beat to offer up a great runwalk. That was definitely evidenced at this clinic. Out of 12 saddles, I'd say there were maybe 2 that were suspect of a less than great fit. It was an amazing, eye-opening clinic headed up by a man that I now have the utmost respect for. He had nothing to sell except good, clear, concise, common sense, and sound techniques. Please don't get me wrong, I am not in any way saying that GOG shouldn't be doing what they're doing, they provide a great service but I sometimes too, feel that it is too often suggested that any given problem is likely the problem with the saddle or the bit, rather than possibly that the rider needs to learn a better technique to get the results he or she is after. Good tack cannot in itself, provide good results. When the clinician added the 'jingle bells' to my horse's hind feet, because he is a little 'trotty' at times, I could hear the different gaits, and along with the very little weight they added, he absolutely reached further with his hind end. I now have some really great tools to bring out the best in my gaited horse and when examining the slope of his shoulder and his conformation, we're going to work on getting better angles over the next few months on his hooves to further help him meet his potential. I had 3 gaited horses in the clinic, and all were markedly improved from Day 1, and they all had 'good gait' when we got there. All were in 3 different types of 'good' well fitting western saddle that accommodate a good shoulder roll, no pressure on the withers or the scapula and rounded skirts to free up the hip. Soft hands, clear communication, proper frame, proper riding technique, motivation AND good tack is what makes a horse, a great horse. Boy, I'm likely to get all banged up for saying this here, and I guess I run the risk of being deleted too, and maybe I didn't say everything the way I meant to say it, but in summary, I DO believe that there are a lot of saddles that fit out there on the market today, a LOT of great saddles, and I'm sure a 4BEAT is definitely one of them; I don't disagree with that, but...there are others that work too. I have been troubled too at times to read on this site where it has been suggested by some members immediately with just about any given problem that 'the saddle is wrong', or 'the bit is wrong'. Power of suggestion is a 'powerful' thing...if you read it enough, you will believe it without question. My question is: Is it okay to say that there are a lot of good gaited saddles out there? Or is there only one? Kathy, if you get lynched, then I'll be hangin' right there with you.
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| Posted: Mon Oct 2nd, 2006 10:34 pm |
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3rd Post |
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whattarack Pasture Boss 
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I realize this site is geared towards the Imus line, but I think more importantly it should be geared towards our beloved gaited breeds. Hi Kathy, I've been on this board for a long time and although many, many of the responses turn up a tack issue, I can assure you that Brenda Imus is all about riding techniques and trainings issues as well as the comfort and soundness of our gaited breeds. The tack that she brings to the table has been an answer, and for me, "the" answer as well as for many others. I am certain that there are horses riding under saddles that don't fit and even under a 4-Beats that doesn't fit. She has never said the 4-beat would fit all horses nor that it was the only saddle to ride a gaited horse under. Yet, she has always said that a horse needs to be comfortable in his tack. Yep. Whatever tack that is. I believe this is true with all horses. It's also true that many horses are not well fitted. Especially gaited horses. Brenda's tack is designed to accommodate especially the gaited breeds. Brenda offers some great products that many people want and many people actually need. The trial period she offers with her saddles speaks volumes to the fact that she wants the horse and rider happy and comfortable. It is up to the rider of course to determine if the tack is right or not. If you don't like the way your horse goes under her saddle, send it back - Please. I am sure she would rather you send it back and be happy with your choice than to keep it with regret. Now, GOG must, must support their own products fully. How can you believe in something and not give it your full support? The MB rules regarding discussion of other brands is a fair rule because members are also not allowed to post negatives about other brands. Yet, when it comes to GOG products, the voices are heard here whether negative or positive. IMO, Negative posts on the 4-Beats usually come from those who should have sent the saddle back during the trial period but for some reason chose not to do so. As to your findings during your clinic, what can I say? I wasn't there. The fact is and Brenda has said it many times, "Listen to your horse." No lynching for you, Kathy. Thanks for the opportunity to make my reply. 
____________________ A State Trooper pulls over a pickup on Highway 16 And says to the driver, 'Got any I..D ? ' . . and the driver replies 'Bout wut?' Being Offended is Optional. |
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| Posted: Mon Oct 2nd, 2006 11:29 pm |
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4th Post |
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Tailgaitin G.O.G Community Member
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Hey, Kathy, Good post with good questions. WR had good responses, and now I'll add mine. Having had several types of saddles in the past, I landed on this site and ended up purchasing a 4Beat. My mare loves it. She moves great in it. I was riding her in a bitless bridle, but had the opportunity to try the ICB to aid in collection, and she loves that, too. Okay, happy horse.  I wanted to learn some more. So off I go to a Brenda Imus clinic with said horse and tack. Tack fits but just needed some tweaking. Great, and we are off and riding. Savvy is as natural a gaiter as the next horse - especially considering that her sire is full APHA and mom is a TWH. However, Savvy can break into a brain rattling pace which I pretty much don't enjoy.l1  Brenda taught us how to handle this issue along with other things. I'll have to say, good tack doesn't make for a smooth horse if you don't know how to sit properly, handle the reins/bit, etc. I also learned how to get impulsion from the horse's back end, and now she really goes into this tremendous head noddin' flatwalk that I'm still facinated with when I'm on trail rides. Yesterday I went for an absolutely wonderful ride with a friend. We were gaiting along and Savvy broke into a pace. What I learned in the clinic was applied and within two seconds she was back into her gait. Before the clinic, I would not have known what to do. This whole clinic was about how to RIDE the gaited horse. Sure saddle fit is important, but like I said, HOW you handle that horse is what makes it so much fun to ride gaited!
____________________ I've Got Gait - just don't know which one! |
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| Posted: Tue Oct 3rd, 2006 12:46 am |
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5th Post |
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Brenda Im Pasture Boss 
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We're not going to lynch anyone - though the brand name of another saddle has been deleted. Not only because it's competition, but I can guarantee that if that brand name stays up here we'll get six or so people who reply with bad experiences with that saddle. We're not into bashing, or promoting, other brand name products. I'm glad your experience was good. I will say this: we do not believe ANY weight on the foot, no matter how 'light,' is an acceptable way to train for gait. A very slight weight on the foot translates into a tremendous load at the shoulder. We don't change up every horse at clinics, either - though admittedly our percentage is higher than what you mention. There are other saddles that do work on some horses, on some occasions. That doesn't change the fact that our tack almost invariably makes an improvement in the majority of horses who are ridden in it. That's been our experience with hundreds of horses. And please be aware that I never set out to invent, manufacture or sell tack, but only began to do so out of desperation because so very many gaited horses simply couldn't gait naturally (without weights or other devices) in the tack that was then available on the market. Every one of our Certified Training Partners has come on board largely because they have seen and experienced the dramatic improvement that the Imus line of tack makes in gaited horses. Anyone who was at Golden Hills, MO this year can attest to that, when dozens of horses were refitted at their owner's requests. Is tack the only answer? Of course NOT!!! We offer a plethora of gait training exercises and techniques for riders to practice. Much of it is free on this website - which is sponsored by the sale of the tack. I'm glad your tack is working, but please be aware that among a dozen horses such as you describe, this number who are truly comfortable enough to gait without artificial devices is definitely the exception to the rule. At our clinics, when we have changed out the tack, we encourage riders to go back to all their own stuff on the last day. Almost invariably, the rider cannot get as good a performance from their horse as they got in our tack. Now, I am going to respectfully close this thread, as this site IS devoted to, and sponsored by, the promotion and sale of our tack. If that makes me a greedy capitalist - then so be it. I'm also a true believer, as are most of those who have experienced our products first hand. Brenda
____________________ Always forgive your enemies. It's good for you - and really messes with their heads! |
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